Trying To ID My Father's Bike

Dalez

New Member
Local time
Today, 08:34
Joined
Oct 9, 2022
Messages
9
Points
2
Age
63
Location
32162
First Name
Dale
My Ride
2022 Speedmaster
The attached picture is from the late 50's. I have the windshield and saddlebags but never knew what bike he had. Recently came across this picture and figured I would see if you can help. For reference my father was 5'2" so it must have been pretty low to the ground.
Thanks
Dale
 

Attachments

  • Dadtriumph.JPG
    Dadtriumph.JPG
    231 KB · Views: 36
I, sadly, can't help you, but that clue about his height should lead our gearheads in the right direction.
 
Adding another pic. Scanned this one hopefully it will be a little more telling.
 

Attachments

  • Dadsidebike.jpg
    Dadsidebike.jpg
    552.9 KB · Views: 35
Run the Vin#
 
I have the windshield, saddle bags and two 65 year old pictures. Not going to get a VIN off any of those. I'm thinking Speed Twin myself after looking at pictures on line.
 
I assumed you had the bike, sorry.
 
thinking Speed Twin
Imho unlikely unless the bike was a bitsa.

First photo - View attachment 53198 - depends what the shiny part between your father's leg and the cylinder head is; if it is a carburettor and not in the centre of the bike, it is one of two, makes the bike a Bonneville but then the photo is not late 1950's - the first Bonnevilles were 59 and had the signature nacelle enclosing the headlamp and fork tops, mounting the speedometer, Ammeter and light switch. Bonnevilles did not come without the nacelle until 60, 650 engines became unit from 63.

If the shiny part is a single carb, tank badge is 57 on. 58 Speed Twin was the last pre unit (crankcase and gearbox separate), 59-66 Speed Twins have unit engines. However, Speed Twins had the nacelle and the 58 Speed Twin had deeply valanced fenders, the bike in the photos does not have either the nacelle or the 58 fenders.

Also unlikely is 57, 58 or 59 Tiger 100 (the Tiger 100 did not get the unit engine until a year after the Speed Twin) just because all the online photos I can find show they had the nacelle too.

If the photo is definitely late 1950's and the bike was not a bitsa built by your father, I think it might have been one of the official Triumph US market 650 bitsas, originally nicknamed the "Trophybird"

Triumph had built the off-road "Trophy" version - first 500, later also 650 - since winning the 1948 International Six Days Trial, with the headlamp enclosed in a separate chromed shell (so it could be detached easily for racing) and the fenders in the photos. Otoh, the on-road 650 - Thunderbird and Tiger 110 - were also supplied with the nacelle and deeply valanced fenders, much disliked in the US. Not sure which dealer built the first but soon several were stripping nacelles and fenders off Thunderbirds and Tiger 110, replacing them with Trophy parts. Meriden eventually gave into pressure from the US importers and, along with the 60 onwards Bonneville, built both on- and off-road versions of the Trophy without nacelle or valanced fenders.

Do you remember the colour of your father's bike? Speed Twin (500) cycle parts were painted a dark red ("Amaranth Red") usually including the frame, swinging arm and rear brake plate. Otoh, Thunderbird (650) cycle parts were painted blue, Tigers and Trophys (500 and 650) were usually black and silver/chrome.
 
Asked my brother in law, he thinks could be/maybe a Thunderbird as pictured. Looks pretty close to my untrained eyes.
95C910C7-73BC-4BCB-A919-9644846A080E.jpeg
 
Imho unlikely unless the bike was a bitsa.

First photo - View attachment 53198 - depends what the shiny part between your father's leg and the cylinder head is; if it is a carburettor and not in the centre of the bike, it is one of two, makes the bike a Bonneville but then the photo is not late 1950's - the first Bonnevilles were 59 and had the signature nacelle enclosing the headlamp and fork tops, mounting the speedometer, Ammeter and light switch. Bonnevilles did not come without the nacelle until 60, 650 engines became unit from 63.

If the shiny part is a single carb, tank badge is 57 on. 58 Speed Twin was the last pre unit (crankcase and gearbox separate), 59-66 Speed Twins have unit engines. However, Speed Twins had the nacelle and the 58 Speed Twin had deeply valanced fenders, the bike in the photos does not have either the nacelle or the 58 fenders.

Also unlikely is 57, 58 or 59 Tiger 100 (the Tiger 100 did not get the unit engine until a year after the Speed Twin) just because all the online photos I can find show they had the nacelle too.

If the photo is definitely late 1950's and the bike was not a bitsa built by your father, I think it might have been one of the official Triumph US market 650 bitsas, originally nicknamed the "Trophybird"

Triumph had built the off-road "Trophy" version - first 500, later also 650 - since winning the 1948 International Six Days Trial, with the headlamp enclosed in a separate chromed shell (so it could be detached easily for racing) and the fenders in the photos. Otoh, the on-road 650 - Thunderbird and Tiger 110 - were also supplied with the nacelle and deeply valanced fenders, much disliked in the US. Not sure which dealer built the first but soon several were stripping nacelles and fenders off Thunderbirds and Tiger 110, replacing them with Trophy parts. Meriden eventually gave into pressure from the US importers and, along with the 60 onwards Bonneville, built both on- and off-road versions of the Trophy without nacelle or valanced fenders.

Do you remember the colour of your father's bike? Speed Twin (500) cycle parts were painted a dark red ("Amaranth Red") usually including the frame, swinging arm and rear brake plate. Otoh, Thunderbird (650) cycle parts were painted blue, Tigers and Trophys (500 and 650) were usually black and silver/chrome.

That's some good info. Picture is dated July-1957 so I guess that rules out Bonneville. Bike was red. I will look at more images online and try to narrow it down. As a new Triumph owner myself it is just sentimental to know what bike he was tooling around on.
 
The attached picture is from the late 50's. I have the windshield and saddlebags but never knew what bike he had. Recently came across this picture and figured I would see if you can help. For reference my father was 5'2" so it must have been pretty low to the ground.
Thanks
Dale
Would that be a Thunderbird on the front fender?
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_20221128-121948_Chrome.jpg
    Screenshot_20221128-121948_Chrome.jpg
    54.5 KB · Views: 5
maybe a Thunderbird as pictured. Looks pretty close to my untrained eyes.
View attachment 53205
... shows:-
the signature nacelle enclosing the headlamp and fork tops, mounting the speedometer, Ammeter and light switch
... otoh, the OP photos appear to show:-
the headlamp enclosed in a separate chromed shell

Picture is dated July-1957
Bike was red
Colour suggests a Speed Twin? Tank badge and picture date suggest a new bike or at least new to your father?

Some US dealers modified bikes to suit local tastes before putting them on sale, and modifying to customer requirements, often with help from the importer.

If a new Speed Twin, possibly modified by the dealer either in the "Trophybird" style or because it was not possible to fit the desired windshield around the standard nacelle?
 
I don't know if it was new or not. I learned quite a bit through this thread though and thank you to all for your help. I know the pictures are poor and I scanned a copy at a high res. but can't find anywhere the image size that is allowed and don't want to post it just to have the software reduce the size.
Good news is I never heard of a bitsa before and now I know what it means.
Thanks, Dale
 
I don't know if it was new or not.
Picture is dated July-1957
The tank badge style in your photos was new for the 57 model year. Triumph generally started producing the new model year bikes beginning late summer of the previous calendar year - ime, they would likely have started producing 57 bikes sometime between about July and September 1956.

Add at least a couple of months for a bike to be shipped to the US importer and then trucked to the dealer so, worst case, someone else bought your father's bike new then traded it in less than year; best case, your father bought the bike new.

never heard of a bitsa before and now I know what it means.
:)
 
With getting ready for the new year I turned the very last page on my "Classic Triumph Calendar 2022" from Baxter Cycle ( 712-781-2351)
is what appears to be an exact photo of your dad's machine. The " pedestrian cutter" on the front fender says "1955" Wolfgang Publications (Tim Remus) can help as he did with getting a calendar shot of my old '66 "Jack Pine". This '22 Calendar is available from Baxter at a reduced cost and would be your quickest shot at a full I.D.. I'd screen shot it but Wolfgang Publications has copyrights to it's photos. Hope this helps you, J. Parker
 
The timing chest doesn’t appear to have the dynamo lug at the front so it looks like an alternator machine. Also it looks as though it has an iron head. 61 was the only year they put an ally head on the preunit Tbird.
 
Further observations would indicate an iron head with a single carb and a single down tube frame. Rudie says tank badge and flashes were new to 57 machines which my reference books agree with. The 650s single down tube frame swapped to a duplex frame in 1960.

It would be useful to establish whether it had a distributor or a magneto. The later being more obvious which does not appear to be so on the photo. The Tbird was fitted with an alternator in 54 but the TonTen had to wait until 1960. My 61 preunit Tbird has the duplex frame and ally head, the only year this head was fitted. The TonTens had the ally head from 56. The Tbird and the TonTen acquired the bath tubs in 1960. So after all my waffling my best guess is a 57 to 59 Tbird.
 
Further observations would indicate an iron head with a single carb and a single down tube frame. Rudie says tank badge and flashes were new to 57 machines which my reference books agree with. The 650s single down tube frame swapped to a duplex frame in 1960.

It would be useful to establish whether it had a distributor or a magneto. The later being more obvious which does not appear to be so on the photo. The Tbird was fitted with an alternator in 54 but the TonTen had to wait until 1960. My 61 preunit Tbird has the duplex frame and ally head, the only year this head was fitted. The TonTens had the ally head from 56. The Tbird and the TonTen acquired the bath tubs in 1960. So after all my waffling my best guess is a 57 to 59 Tbird.
Thanks. I was wondering when you were going to get to the meat of the issue.
 
Premium

Support TriumphTalk by becoming a Premium Member.

 What You Get

Donate

 

 

Search

Back
Top Bottom